While the Servant of the Secret Shrill might not be Aware of All Internet Traditions, he’s as right as you could be about this:
Watching some liberal members of the House explain why they won’t do what’s necessary, and pass the Senate bill, I was wondering what they imagine will happen. Then the answer came to me: it’s the Underpants Gnomes business plan…:
1. Reject the only bill that can be enacted any time soon.
2. ?????
3. Universal coverage!Sigh.
I got nothing but love for Jane Hamsher most hours of the day, but she really needs to check herself on this. Seriously. Now.
I’m not blaming her and the lib faction exclusively for the weakening resolve on HCR passage. There’s Stupak’s panty sniffing mysoginists humping their coat hangers. And the Blue Dogs - running from the Senate bill like methed up lemmings chasing down a cliff all becauseMassachussetts residents elected Scott Browncake in reaction to a persistently shitty economy rampant unemployment a terrible Democratic candidate lack of positive movement in Washington the esoteric details of a health care reform bill. It’s true. Fox news told me so!
Given the stakes, every single last not-Republican needs to be pushing with all their might to get the bill passed – even if it means passing the Senate version, and then tinkering later. Don’t get me wrong, I’m aware that the Senate version is an inferior bill in many ways (the House bill isn’t exactly a masterpiece either), but it represents a vast improvement over the status quo, and, what’s monumentally more important, it is the ONLY AVAILABLE OPTION!
That’s it. One bite of the apple, and then the princess falls back asleep for another 15-20 years, while thousands of uninsured…die because of lack of insurance. Maybe we can console the families of the deceased with the warmth emanating from our self-satisfied smiles.
Unless, that is, someone wants to explain to me how our current crop of legislators could get a fillibuster proof bloc to support a more progressive bill. When they couldn’t do that before Browncake was elected. What, now Lieberman, Nelson, Landrieu and Olympia Snowe will support the public option? Or Medicare buy-in?
Or is it that after the Dems get slaughtered in the midterms and Obama’s political capital evaporates (each, in large part because of the self-inflicted defeat of HCR), then the new, more Republicanized House and Senate will come up with a more progressive bill.
This would be properly labeled madness if it weren’t so bone dumb. We are a parody of ourselves.
January 22, 2010 at 1:30 pm
This whole representative “democracy” thing just isn’t all it’s cracked up to be.
January 24, 2010 at 1:17 pm
Yeah. What Peorgie said. Representative is the key word.
January 22, 2010 at 2:01 pm
Seems to me they’d already botched it so bad it wasn’t worth passing, and the reason they botched it so bad was because they didn’t really want to pass a real healtchcare reform bill anyway.
I bought my pony last November. It’s doing fine. When I bought it, I knew that the enemy was no longer the Reps and its Clone Army of Plumber Joes. The enemy was about half the elected Dem congressionals.
The logic that said Vote for la Hillary because only she could win is, to my eyes, the same logic that says an almost totally wankered sliver of a health care reform bill is the only thing that can get passed. I ain’t buying it.
But yeah, it sucks that more people will die. But then, body counts rule, good intentions drool.
It’s been over 225 years since the colonies revolted and formed the USA. I doubt we’ll get more than 1 or 2 decades more before the Counter Revolution happens.
January 22, 2010 at 2:04 pm
I dunno KL, both Krugman and Ezra Klein (and other wonky types whose opinions I respect and defer to on these matters) argued quite persuasively that the bill was still a big time improvement over the status quo.
January 22, 2010 at 5:31 pm
Yeah, and that was my thinking until Pelosi pulled the plug. Up till then, I’d say, ‘That’s how America works, increment by back-stepping increment, so establishing a toehold is good, and we’ll progress from there.’
But now I think how Health Care Reform (HCR) is a Big Thing. We didn’t pass Social Security in tiny bites; we made a major move. We ended slavery with a bloody war.
These are, after all, mostly the same buncha clown who passed the Patriot Act w/out reading it.
For now, I’m hoping that Obama is giving them enough rope to really hang themselves and give him opportunity to cast a perfect storm from his bully pulpite that tsunami whammies both parties.
Next week I’ll have a new slant. I’m an American after all. Volatile. Flexible. Erratic. Gullible.
Anyway, the bill ezra and Paul see as a big improvement (and I’m sure it is) is not going to make it now. Now with these wonder monkeys. They lack the backbone to squeeze Charmin.
We got our pony, but the jackasses are still jackasses and as for those pachyderms, they’re like circus elephants in a circle with each other’s tail wrapped firmly by their nose. Or this.
January 22, 2010 at 5:34 pm
It’s too late. Do the math. The Dems have 58 senate seats, plus Lieberman. They need 60 to break a filibuster. Every Dem Senator and Representative could sign on to the best possible outcome: single payer, public provided insurance and guess what. The GOP would fillibuster and the bill would die.
Nothing. Nada. That would be the result. Bullypulpit or not. HCR now lives and dies on the Dems ability to convince one GOP senator to defect. And support, ostensibly, a far more progressive piece of legislation.
Even though not one would vote for the Senate bill as it currently stands.
Nagahappen.
January 22, 2010 at 10:20 pm
kenmeer,
You’re wrong about Social Security. It started off as a much smaller and weaker program and was gradually improved to include more people, with better benefits.
January 24, 2010 at 3:52 am
as does Nate Silver at http://fivethirtyeight.com
Look this is Constitution and the deals that were made to get it to fruition is full of paradoxes like the Senate and the House. It was once 66 votes for a filibuster, we can change it to 55, they claim that’s the nuclear option, they can go fuck themselves, defense attorneys will say anything and that’s what a conservative is a defense advocate for the status quo which is plutocracy, kleptocracy, oligarchy. The same people who write the bills, kick back money, then find the elections.
So it’s like when a lawyer ignores your calls and letters, they’re operating in bad faith and will continue to do so until a judge tells them not to and someone executes the law. So yes the system is bad, what ever came out of the sausage machine was going to be flawed, that doesn’t mean you don’t, at the end of the day take the bargain, you fight like hell for your side, but you leave with something instead of nothing.
55,000 Americans die, according to Harvard, due to lack of Health Insurance, if this mitigate tens of thousands of deaths which it will, it’s worth. The avg American without health care is single mother, waitress.
It can and will be changed like Medicare Social Security, civil rights acts, it will be and needs to be amended, but you have to get your foot in the door. This program will become a sacred cow in ten years and the GOP will “love” it like they “love” medicare. That’s Billy Clintons take, and he seems to know something about politics. So I think Obama should go all in on the bet that the people want and need and will like the features of HCR. They don’t like “the bill”. But they love the features and details when they are explained. Don’t by the line item bitch and moan session. I’ve watched this package constructed in all 5 committees and it could be a lot worse considering the other bills done by Bush (5) under reconciliation, 22 since 1980. I think if this was a White Republican we would have done it already and Invaded Iran. The details haven’t been effectively communicated.
You can’t go to the state of the union with nothing, that it’s scheduled tells me the tracks are laid either way for something. Just because we are building a small institution now doesn’t mean it can’t or won’t grow, because it will, the public option will be back, the people want it.
This is all on the people at the end of the day. Sometimes we the people have to assert our sovereignty, or what are we doing? Who am I? What do I believe in? It’s gut check time after CU v. FEC. 20 years later do you want to look back and regret that you didn’t participate more fully in your democracy and then you lost it?
January 22, 2010 at 4:36 pm
It’s worth passing if for no reason other than it will piss off the tea baggers.
January 22, 2010 at 6:14 pm
So there you are. Nagahappen. Pull the plug. I’m no Pelosi fan, but she knows house politics. It’s dead.
January 22, 2010 at 6:21 pm
But it’s not dead if they pass the Senate version – and maybe try to make some changes in reconcilliation.
The only way it’s dead is if enough Dems in the house refuse to vote yes for the Senate bill.
Hence my cri de couer. It’s not over yet. There’s still time to salvage it. Just need the House Dems to wake the fuck up.
January 22, 2010 at 6:51 pm
‘There’s still time to salvage it. Just need the House Dems to wake the fuck up.’
One pony every 8 years seems to be the rule these days? Look, if the House Dems really do grow spines and pass something remotely like HCR, I’m not gonna tell ‘em not to, OK?
I think we’re looking at a much bigger battle than a struggle for HCR. Montag the recent Supreme Court corporate political contribution ruling. We’re deeply in late-stage capitalism. Oil is running out. We may be whacking out the weather. I think a much larger shift, a major paradigm change, is afoot, and it sucks everything into it. (To me, that is the lesson of the past 8 years’ insanity.)
I think we’re watching the Twilight of the Megacorps, and just like the days when dinos ruled the earth, the last thing expected was that shrews and moles would soon be in charge and grow into whales and tigers and humans.
We focus on how massive and corrupt was the Wall Street meltdown; we forget that it melted down and is still far from solvent or stable. One year’s profits and deplorable banker bonuses doesn’t mean it’s solvent. It ain’t, and it’s sitting on a rotten foundation.
Why do the bankers risk enormous public censure, after a year of same, by padding their pockets as much as they can?
Same reason the smartest rats risk a trip through the kitchen before heading for the deck: they know the ship’s sinking.
I want HCR. I want a sustainable economy. I want a sane foreign policy.
Nagahappen. I think I know how smart Germans felt in the ’20s, recognizing that German still had a major case of Kaiseritis, and when it flared up again, it would be more severe than ever.
I just don;t see much point in short term pragmatic politics anymore. They’re no longer sufficient to the insanity of bloated empire.
January 22, 2010 at 10:25 pm
didn’t read downthread before posting. I see this is already noted.
January 22, 2010 at 4:58 pm
Sorry, but I just can’t ignore the reasoned opinion that the Senate bill is bad, so bad, in fact, that it’s shit on wheels. It’s ultimately going to do more harm than good, and that’s the definition of a bad bill.
Why should we accept a bad bill from the least-representative of the two bodies of Congress? Because Harry Reid can’t think of a way to cut out the obstructionists and get his own troops into line? That’s not nearly a good enough excuse.
Beyond that, I think it’s a pipe dream to think that this bill can be improved in the near term. The moment any bill is passed and signed, Congress is going to drop health care reform like a hot potato, and won’t revisit it for a generation, if that. I can hear the line now, “health care reform? We already did that….”
Last, if the Senate bill goes through, the lobbyists win again, and on something this important, they really do need to lose. Almost as important, this bill will end up being very politically unpopular when it’s actually implemented and the Democrats will own it, lock, stock and barrel. The Repugs will be able to sit back and say, “hey, we didn’t vote for this piece of shit. Blame the people who did.” This bill will get them back in the game, whereas the Dems’ passage of a good bill puts them in the catbird seat for a while, and leaves the Repugs out in the cold as mean-spirited obstructionists.
Why can’t the Dems actually fight for the best possible deal for the people, rather than for the for-profit industry? If they can’t do that, they might as well give up and go grow watermelons.
January 22, 2010 at 5:33 pm
“Almost as important, this bill will end up being very politically unpopular when it’s actually implemented and the Democrats will own it, lock, stock and barrel. The Repugs will be able to sit back and say, “hey, we didn’t vote for this piece of shit. Blame the people who did.” ”
Ees szo troow.
January 22, 2010 at 5:36 pm
No, passing nothing would be worse. And those are the only two options until someone can explain to me, again, how you plan on getting a GOP Senator to defect and support a far more progressive bill, even though none voted for the current incarnation.
And that assumes perfect discipline with the likes of Lieberpuke, Nelson, Landrieu, etc.
January 22, 2010 at 6:18 pm
Nagahappen, right? So I’d rather have them pass nothing and take the heat for being useless than… uh… well, that’s all there is, so whatever, see?
It’s over. Be patient, I guess? Ask black people. This is America. We make money, not sense.
January 22, 2010 at 6:23 pm
No. If the House votes yes on the Senate bill, then the Senate bill passes both houses and lands on Obama’s desk.
Literally tens of thousands of lives are saved. Countless hardships averted. The Dems get all the positive press of actually achieving something. The press flocks to winners.
January 22, 2010 at 6:33 pm
Well, not passing the Senate bill and not passing anything are not the same thing.
Passage of the Senate bill is, frankly, slow political suicide for the Dems. It doesn’t solve the major problems (cost containment and universal coverage), and it creates new ones (moreover, no one has yet said one word about how this galumphing fat horror gets through the rulemaking process and into the CFR without a lot more agony and interference by the for-profit industry).
Passing a great bill would put the Repugs on the defensive, something they very much need to feel, for a change. Otherwise, they win now, and win later, and people end up worse off. When the Dems were in the minority, and tried to thwart the Repugs, what happened? The Repugs threatened them with the “nuclear option,” and the Dems backed down. Now, Reid won’t play hardball with the Repugs in the same way.
Frankly, what I’d like to hear is Pelosi saying, “we can’t pass the Senate bill. It’s bad for the people. So, we’re going to start over with a bill that isn’t a compromise of a compromise from the get-go and will be good for the people, and we’re going to fix Medicare Part D in the process.”
But, we’re talking about Dems, aren’t we? So, I don’t expect that to happen. However, this sudden urgency to get the Senate bill passed smells of a railroad job. In real life, I walk away from high-pressure sales pitches and never come back, and this sounds like one to me.
January 22, 2010 at 7:03 pm
Well, not passing the Senate bill and not passing anything are not the same thing.
True. But the only alterantive to the Senate bill is a bill that would appeal to at least one Republican. Hence, an even shittier bill.
You haven’t answered the fundamental question, and until you do, all talk about “good bills” is entirely meaningless.
How do you convince one GOP Senator to vote for a more progressive bill when none supported even the current version?
If you can’t do that, you can’t pass a bill.
The reason they can pass the Senate bill is that the Senate already voted for it. And the Dems got every Dem to vote for it, plus Lieberman. That was 59 + 1 for the fillibuster proof 60 votes. But now that Scott Brown is in the Senate, the Dems only have 58 + 1, so you need a GOP Senatore.
It’s simple, if cruel, math.
Passage of the Senate bill is, frankly, slow political suicide for the Dems. It doesn’t solve the major problems (cost containment and universal coverage), and it creates new ones
It doesn’t “solve” the problem of universal coverage, but it covers tens of millions more people. A very strong move in the right direction. It doesn’t “solve” the problem of cost containment, but it does make significant gains in reducing costs.
Those are good things. Popular things.
Passing a great bill would put the Repugs on the defensive, something they very much need to feel, for a change.
I agree in theory, but they can’t pass any bill without at least 1 GOP Senator voting for it. Why would a GOP Senator do that when none would even vote for the current incarnation because it was “socialism” and when doing so would, as you say, put the GOP on the defensive? It’s simple, if cruel, math.
Otherwise, they win now, and win later, and people end up worse off.
No, something like 30 million people would get insurance, and insurance companies would be prevented from denying coverage to people with pre-existing conditions, and kicking people off their rolls when they get sick.
Those people would be MUCH BETTER off.
Frankly, what I’d like to hear is Pelosi saying, “we can’t pass the Senate bill. It’s bad for the people. So, we’re going to start over with a bill that isn’t a compromise of a compromise from the get-go and will be good for the people, and we’re going to fix Medicare Part D in the process.”
It would be nice to hear I suppose, but only for a fleeting moment, until you realize that Pelosi can’t pass any bill unless she gets one GOP Senator to vote for it.
And that will never, never, never ever, ever happen.
No GOP senator is going to vote for a progressive bill that will ensure Democratic Party success for the next decade or more.
However, this sudden urgency to get the Senate bill passed smells of a railroad job. In real life, I walk away from high-pressure sales pitches and never come back, and this sounds like one to me.
Look, I know I sound like a broken record, but reality is as it is. Now that Scott Brown took a Dem Senate seat, the Dems need one GOP Senate vote to pass any new bill.
The urgency is because of that fact, and the fact that since the senate already passed this bill, if the House votes yes, it’s on Obama’s desk and then a law.
Otherwise, nothing. Unless you can explain why a GOP Senator would vote for Pelosi’s dream bill.
January 22, 2010 at 6:31 pm
Also, I disagree that Social Security was tiny when it passed. It reflected the thinking of the time and so didn’t cover women nd minorities because America at that time was a white man’s world. For the time, it was very big.
January 26, 2010 at 5:38 am
No women? The first monthly recipient was Ida May Fuller (1940) and the SSN 001-01-0001 was issued to Grace D. Owen who applied for her number on November 24, 1936.
January 27, 2010 at 10:28 am
Aye. But as a widow. Her entitlement hinged on having been married to a man.
January 24, 2010 at 3:55 am
You could have said the same thing about the Civil Rights Act, it needs to progress via amendment and it will. We either get 5-10% of what we want or nothing. If it means 10,000 people don’t die because of lack of access to preventive care, it’s worth it. and as the people see the value, it will be progressively expanded. This is the right play, and I don’t like it either.
January 22, 2010 at 5:17 pm
ARRRGGGHHHH.
I love people who sit back and talk about how terrible the bill are and how they’re not going to support it. Those are people who have insurance.
My father hasn’t had insurance in a decade, because he’s self-employed. My sister is $50,000 in debt after a botched surgery because of medical bills. My brother has no insurance. My closest friend hasn’t had insurance in a year since he lost his job. He developed an eye infection and only got it treated because his doctor was willing to do it for free. How would you like to have your vision depend on your doctor’s charity?
The Senate bill is the best thing we can get for now. It would have helped or will help every single person I just cited above. And you don’t care. That makes you just as bad as the cowards in the Senate who backed away from a year’s worth of work the instant they encountered a setback.
Yeah, I would like a better bill. I’d also like a billion dollars. But this is the bill I can get, and I’m going to go to work every day for my crappy paycheck too. Because it’s better than nothing.
If anyone thinks for one second that rejecting this bill magically gets us a better deal down the road, they’re delusional. In case you didn’t notice, the Supreme Court just opened the floodgates for a whole shit-ton of corporate cash. Your chance of getting a better health care reform done with billions of dollars being spent by corporations on campaigning against it in a few months are nil. Even if, historically, this legislation didn’t come back weaker every damn time it went away. Nixon’s bill — better than this Clinton’s. Clinton’s bill — better than Obama’s. What do you think we’re going to get next round, when that comes about in another 20 years?
Every Democrat not spending their his or her time trying to get the House to spend the Senate bill has lost his/her damn minds. This is it, people. There is no alternative.
Social Security covered next to no one when it passed. Medicare was small and weak. You pass the framework and improve on it. You make the CONCEPT of universal healthcare a reality, because once people have it they are never willing to let it go, and work on improving it. Fixing shit is hard. Buck the hell up.
January 22, 2010 at 5:48 pm
Honestly, I feel like I’m losing my mind watching Dems blow this. The closest parallel I can think of is the feeling I had in the run up to the Iraq war.
This is so obvious, it hurts. Actually, it kills. Tens of thousands of people will die without this bill.
And we’re busy arguing about hypothetical better bills that would be literally impossible to sign because no GOP senator is going to get on board with that agenda.
Fuck man.
January 24, 2010 at 3:58 am
I totally agree. It’s citizen go time. It’s not like we have to go to the South Pacific or liberate Europe, try this first.
http://ourstodecide.org/
we need to get off our collective arses, and stop venting on the internets, relieving the pressure and making us feel better.
January 22, 2010 at 6:26 pm
“Social Security covered next to no one when it passed. Medicare was small and weak. ”
I learn something new every day.
Kenmeer’s Position: I wouldn’t mind passing a weak bill if it wasn’t being passed so weakly it isn’t going to pass at all, see?
At this point, all I can see is tossing out a bunch of Dems and putting in some new ones. Not here in Washington, though. My senator, Patty Murray, has been fairly solid on this.
I have immediate family suffering horrible cruel disabling disease (CRPS and nerve damage from CRPS therapeutic surgery) and relying on Medicaid. DEFINITELY better than nothing.
Anyway, like I said above: we’re fucked. I’m no Rules for Radical-thumping Abbie Hoffman nostalgist, but I see us heading toward MAJOR national crisis in the next 20 years.
France did it. Germany did it. America saved Britain from the worst of its mid-20th century collapse. Japan did it. Seems to be part of a major nation’s growth cycle to drown in one’s own shit and then resurrect with one’s head at last out of one’s ass.
January 22, 2010 at 6:28 pm
‘one’s head at last out of one’s ass.’
For awhile, anyway.
January 22, 2010 at 5:32 pm
It’s ultimately going to do more harm than good, and that’s the definition of a bad bill.
What is your evidence for this? In what ways are Krugman and Ezra wrong?
Why should we accept a bad bill from the least-representative of the two bodies of Congress?
This is the only option. It’s this, or nothing. Lieberman, Nelson, Landrieu and Olympia Snowe would not only not all vote for the current bill, but they sure as hell wouldn’t vote for a more progressive bill.
That’s all. It sucks. It “shouldn’t” be that way. But it is that way. We need to deal with reality.
As for Reid’s ability to discipline Dems, he could get all 58 plus Lieberman to sign on to single payer public provided insurance and guess what: the GOP would fillibuster.
Please explain how Reid is suppoed to convince one GOP Senator to defect with a more progressive bill? Or even this bill on a revote?
Beyond that, I think it’s a pipe dream to think that this bill can be improved in the near term. The moment any bill is passed and signed, Congress is going to drop health care reform like a hot potato, and won’t revisit it for a generation, if that. I can hear the line now, “health care reform? We already did that….”
To the extent that is true, it is also true that if this bill fails, Congress is going to drop health care reform like a hot potato, and won’t revisit it for a generation, if that. I can hear the line now, “health care reform? We already tried to do that….”
is going to drop health care reform like a hot potato, and won’t revisit it for a generation, if that. I can hear the line now, “health care reform? We already did that….”
The insurance industry and other health care interests are lobbying intensely against this bill. You’re suggesting that they will have lost if HCR goes down in flames?
This bill will get them back in the game, whereas the Dems’ passage of a good bill puts them in the catbird seat for a while, and leaves the Repugs out in the cold as mean-spirited obstructionists
Sure, and if wishes were ponies…
Why can’t the Dems actually fight for the best possible deal for the people, rather than for the for-profit industry?
It’s too late. Do the math. The Dems have 58 senate seats, plus Lieberman. They need 60 to break a filibuster. They could fight as hard as possible. Every Dem Senator and Representative could sign on to single payer, public provided insurance and guess what: the GOP would fillibuster.
This is the only option, take it or leave it.
Given the choice, the answer is beyond obvious: take it. Think of the millions of Americans that would have insurance coverage. Think of the tens of thousands of people that won’t be cheated of life because they lack insurance.
That’s worth doing. Full stop.
January 22, 2010 at 7:48 pm
At least Republicans would be able to pass it without needing 60 votes nor having to buy off an endless parade of preening Senators in suicide vests.
January 22, 2010 at 7:54 pm
This whole needing-60-votes-to-change-a-fucking-lightbulb shit is seriously fucked up, and it needs to change. It doesn’t have to be that way. It’s just some bullshit rule. Fuck the Senate and fuck their goddamn rules, and fuck their goddamn precious fucking comity. And fuck what’s-his-fucking-name from South Carolina or Delaware or wherever who in 1780-whatever caused the fucking Senate to even fucking exist. It’s an elitist fucking anachronism of an institution. It’s worst than having a goddamn Queen.
January 22, 2010 at 8:34 pm
Sorry. Had to get that out of my system.
January 22, 2010 at 9:19 pm
righteous rant
January 22, 2010 at 9:19 pm
in response to the person who said that it is suicide for the democrats to pass this bad bill well i think thats the best choice they have now politically speaking.
if the best thing u can say to voters is that u almost passed what they wanted u to but couldnt agree on anything except for a piece of crap but then u realized at the last minute that it was crap so u didnt pass anything…well ur screwed. better to pass the crap and just tell everyone that its great.
January 22, 2010 at 9:21 pm
for the 30 million that get insurance finally, and for the many people with preconditions that get insurance, and for those that get sick yet don’t get kicked off the rolls of their insurance carrier, this bill is most definitely NOT crap.
You won’t have to convince them. Trust me.
January 24, 2010 at 7:42 pm
That’s the fact, Jack.
January 22, 2010 at 10:04 pm
Krugman is even righter in the follow-up.
Especially about the yes-we-can vacuum from President Hope’n'Change
January 23, 2010 at 12:39 am
Twenty years? I believe you if by “thousands” you mean “eight hundred sixty thousand.”
It’s a hypothetical, though. At this rate the country will be bankrupt long before then — or torn asunder by a civil war between the health care execs who want to keep tax rates low so they can take baths in hundred-dollar bills, and the middle managers who need the tax rates to go up so they can make their quarterly number and have their own shot at fiat currency bathing.
January 23, 2010 at 7:54 am
Looks to me like he’s letting Congress disembowel itself all its lonesome.
Question: why did anyone here think the Congress proven to be so gutless the past 8 years would acquire intestinal fortitude because they got a pony in the White House?
Dems were useless then; they’re useless now.
One thing the Reps have going for them as a power bloc is
a) they’re well practiced in marching lockstep
b) they had it all and lost it and they want it back
c) cognitive denial is a very powerful and reliable motivator that thrives on focusing anger at your perceived enemy.
Dems don’t have these fighting attitude advantages. They have an alleged bias to do right by the people and an ancient tradition of being beholden to financial backers. They couldn’t stand together in a game of football but instead wandered around like golfers. They’re a herd of cats meowing for dinner.
I don’t like it anymore than you do, and if they pass even a crappy HCR, I’ll be happy to have something, but I’m already gearing up for failure now and a major struggle ahead when Obama hammers both parties for letting X million Americans suffer or die for want of essential medical care.
Did anyone think that creating a Dem party that remotely resembled its alleged ideals would be easy?
January 23, 2010 at 8:05 am
I guess thisis partly why the WH is relatively silent now:
“a big hangup is that more than half of House Democrats don’t want to pass the Senate version of the bill with the promise that the bigger differences they’ve already been hammering out would be fixed with a second bill.
“The bottom line is that many members feel betrayed by the White House and Senate and just don’t trust that a fix would pass. If their fears pan out, members would be left with a more conservative bill than they passed last fall, and none of the compromises they negotiated with union leaders on how to pay for health care.
“Members feel President Obama showed deference to his old colleagues in the Senate from the beginning of the health care discussions and the House was rolled each step in the way.
“Everyone in the house feels like the White House bent over backwards to engage the Senate and they didn’t get anything for it anyway,” one leadership aide told TPMDC.”
So the Senate sucked Obama’s soul dry. Maybe it was soixante neuf. But, apparently, they’ve sucked so much there’s nothing left to suck but suck.
January 23, 2010 at 9:00 am
Mistress Digby pointed this out so well. With no public option and with mandates, the bill essentially says to the great unwashed low informaiton independent twenty-to-forty something voter: “Hey you gotta buy some crappy insurance you don’t want and don’t need and if you did, God forbid, need, too bad, cuz you ain’t gettin NUTTIN’ back, see?”
A lot of stupid insurance tricks are still there. And the price of insurance will still be going up up up. Gotta pay for those carnivals in Venice for the Presidente por viva of the bean counters, dontcha know. Never get into an argument with fellas who by caviar by the oil-drum.
January 23, 2010 at 9:20 am
I correct: who, by caviar, but the oil-drum
For the elite rich, barter economy means something very different than it means to us.
January 23, 2010 at 9:08 am
‘buy’, not ‘by’
January 23, 2010 at 9:17 am
Okay, Captain Cryptic (aka secondharmonic) who’s Mistress Digby?
January 23, 2010 at 9:21 am
ummm… ‘buy’ not “but”. Next?
January 23, 2010 at 11:19 am
You gotta admit though, as farcical theatre Shakespeare would have loved our Congress. Though I’m having a hard time separating the tragedy from the farce.
January 23, 2010 at 11:20 am
Wow, I really like my avatar. The lobster claws are just plain bitchin’!!
January 23, 2010 at 11:29 am
Drawn butter costs extra
January 25, 2010 at 9:03 am
As long as I get one of those cute bibs for my self cannibalism it’s all good.
January 23, 2010 at 11:32 am
The answer is no. I’m like Cass Sunstein, a rational, self interested person. I’m a young, healthy dude, and so mandating me to buy shitty insurance with ridiculous co-pays for something as simple (and cheap, back in the day) as a tooth cleaning makes me say
Kill [the] Bill.
And fuck the corporate shills who want to pass the bill – not you, Curvy, you’re good people. But still, what trust, exactly, has the Senate gained from the netroots? I trust Digby’s take on that abortion of a youtube from Alan Grayson and Chris Matthews way more than any promise from the Senate to actually help people.
I’m actually surprised T-Shirts and more spoofs on that level haven’t happened. The Too Liberal For Obama shirts are as far as that’s gone to date.
January 23, 2010 at 11:49 am
As long as you’re comfortable with the fact that killing the bill means 35 million Americans without health insurance, less funding for Medicaid, less funding for community health clinics, denial for preconditions, the continuation of insurance companies booting sick people from their coverage and, because of the aforementioned, tens of thousands of people whose lives will end prematurely each year because they can’t afford health care, then, yeah, kill it.
Not to mention those that survive, but go bankrupt in the process, lives ruined, etc.
Just hope that neither you, nor your family, nor anyone you know is one of those unlucky ones. And just provide assurances that as long as neither you, nor your family, nor anyone you know is so unlucky, that you’re perfectly content that such a fate will inevitably befall tens of thousands of Americans a year – but people that you don’t personally know.
I’m not as comfortable. I’d rather pass a flawed bill and help people, but helping people is kind of why I hang to the left in the first place.
And fuck the corporate shills who want to pass the bill
The health insurance industry has spent hundreds of millions to stop this bill. They want this bill killed yesterday. Other corporate health interests: ditto. This is not a corporate friendly bill.
The bill is watered down because of the demands of “moderate” Dems in the Senate like Lieberman and Nelson, but Lieberman and Nelson don’t “want” to pass the bill. They were bribed and cajoled by Dem leaderhsip and so they finally, reluctantly, voted yes.* They would be thrilled if it goes down in defeat. I doubt they’d even shed croc tears.
(*I would have liked to have seen more hardnose disciplining from Reid and Obama of the recalcitrant conservaDems, but that story’s already been written)
January 23, 2010 at 12:02 pm
As puerile and superficial as American politics tend to be, HCR is not a passing fad. The fact that 35 mill Americans will continue to be coverage-less will only fan the flames.
I vividly remember persons on this here “toot exhorting us to vote for ANY Dem that could take the office.
That kind of logic gave the Reps McCain as candidate. Ignoring that logic got us a pony.
January 23, 2010 at 12:04 pm
Thanks for the quick reply.
That said, the insurance industry has proven itself to be a greedy succubus, willing to backstab our Prez over any little thing, from drug re-importation to funding death panel nonsense. And spare me the life count. I’m sorry for them, but this seriously won’t help all of them – can any of those poverty stricken people, in this economy, help them with copays? Look at HAMP – the program that was supposed to help underwater homeowners, and tell me that this Senate wants to save lives.
And with the latest Court decision, that takes whatever’s left off the reins of these evil bastards. Why do you think there aren’t ads on right now? B/c they love the mandate and the total lack of cost controls on… anything.
We can bitch about Democrats being spineless pussies – it seems the smart money is on how Obama left the negotiations to Max Baucus. But the fact remains that this Senate bill is utter dogshit, and the Dem lobbyist types (read, Lawrence O’Donnell) are all fluttering about, saying that reconciliation won’t work, and we better pass the bill or 2010 will mean the end of the Progressive Era. As I know this Era, I haven’t seen one thing go our way, save for, maybe, Net Neutrality.
Again, I repeat, there is no reason for the Congress to trust the Senate on anything. Hell, even that Ben Nelson amendment coulda been changed to every state, and that failed! That, plus the abortion crap, means that I’d rather have a reconciliation bill that expands Medicare and increases poverty level Medicaid with no Coraline strings attached.
January 23, 2010 at 2:31 pm
Again, I repeat, there is no reason for the Congress to trust the Senate on anything.
Even if the Senate doesn’t perform the fixes, this bill will cover 35 million currently uninsured. That, unfortunately, is not everyone who lacks insurance. Millions will still have no coverage at all. But 35 million is a lot of people to help – not to mention those that will benefit from improved funding of Medicaid, community health, etc.
And spare me the life count. I’m sorry for them, but this seriously won’t help all of them – can any of those poverty stricken people, in this economy, help them with copays?
No, it won’t help all the uninsured. But it will help most of the uninsured. And last time I checked, that’s still a huge win.
It’s this, or nothing. I prefer this. It’s actually a no-brainer.
January 23, 2010 at 5:52 pm
Even if the Senate doesn’t perform the fixes, this bill will cover 35 million currently uninsured.
Coverage is not care.
And the 30 million that get “coverage” get it at the expense of hundreds of millions more being forced to pony up dough to the same crooks who caused this mess.
No, it’s not worth it.
Let the senate pass the fixes first, then the house can pass the Senate bill. That’s the only way to take the broken glass out of this shit sandwich.
Otherwise, oh well.
January 23, 2010 at 2:47 pm
Why do you think there aren’t ads on right now? B/c they love the mandate and the total lack of cost controls on… anything.
But that isn’t true. As Ezra notes:
There are also new regulations on insurers forcing them to spend between 80 percent and 85 percent of every premium dollar on medical care, barring them from rejecting you or charging you higher premiums due to preexisting conditions, ensuring they can’t place any annual caps on insurance benefits, and more.
That is a massive improvement over the status quo. The insurance industry is fighting this bill. Make no mistake.
January 23, 2010 at 6:06 pm
How many times have we heard this refrain.
It’s smply not so.
Any insurance company has thousands of lawyers who get paid handsomely just to find ways around regs like these.
Is age a preexisting condition? Because the Senate bill states that those over 50 can be charged up to 300% what a person in their mid 20s would pay in premiums.
And the annual caps were quietly reinserted by Harry Reid, although I heard a rumor they came out again, we just don’t know until we see the final bill, the provisions change week to week and day to day.
The medicaid expansion is not worth the cost. In my state people on medicaid are treated like lepers, and they can boot you from a treatment program for something as simple as missing an appointment. Anyone who thinks the medicaid expansion is progressive has a sad, inadequate view of what that word should mean.
The subsidies to community clinics are good, but they could be passed in a standalone bill, without all the pork and corporate subsidies attached.
This bill is NOT a “massive improvement” on the status quo, and the House needs to stand firm and make the Senate pass the reconciliation fix first, before the House passes the senate bill.
The senate bill cannot be allowed to stand as the totality of HCR, it would be worse than nothing.
Oh, one tiresome duty, before I’m dismissed as someone who’s rich, young and insured or over-insured, let me assure you that I am none of those things.
January 24, 2010 at 8:09 am
Coverage is not care.
Right. Coverage enables you to purchase the care. Even single payer is single payer coverage. Not sure what you mean here.
And the 30 million that get “coverage” get it at the expense of hundreds of millions more being forced to pony up dough to the same crooks who caused this mess.
No. This is not true.
Currently, roughly 85% of Americans are already covered under employer provided insurance, their own purchased insurance and Medicare/Medicaid.
Those people would not have to “pony up” anything. Of those that are uninsured, there are subsidies to help those with less money do the ponying.
January 23, 2010 at 12:19 pm
Oh, and before anyone forgets, I remember some other piece of legislation that demanded we pass it or something would die. Something about…
The bank bailout!
I’m sorry I can’t link to various Kos or FDL links about how the House can kinda pinky swear the Senate to pass a reconciliation fix-it to the bill if they pass it clean, but I’m sure you know about it already. But the real deal is, that if the progressives back down on this, then they are the designated bitches (as they’ve always been, what I was alluding to with the Grayson comment).
The media’s ready with the same-old narrative, and, even more important than the healthcare bill (and I realize the lives involved), the financial regulation and climate change stuff has yet to be done, and we need to show the balls (that wins elections, natch) necessary to win those rounds. Those are a magnitude bigger where it concerns the human race, and it needs to be shown that, if the media doesn’t want to actually learn from the Massachusetts race – where Obama Dems stayed home and McCain people showed up – that policy matters.
January 23, 2010 at 2:37 pm
Oh, and before anyone forgets, I remember some other piece of legislation that demanded we pass it or something would die. Something about…
The bank bailout!
Not really an apt analogy at all. This site wasn’t touting the bailout bill, and the range of motion was much broader for the Dems because they had the leverage – the monied interests needed help, and they were desperate.
Now, it’s only poor desperate people.
And for some reason, too many progressive Dems that should no better are willing to let tens of millions of Americans go without insurance on principle. So we don’t “back down” or “look weak.”
As if failing to pass HCR is going to make the Dems look strong. As if the media isn’t going to savage the Dems for that failure.
The media’s ready with the same-old narrative, and, even more important than the healthcare bill (and I realize the lives involved), the financial regulation and climate change stuff has yet to be done, and we need to show the balls (that wins elections, natch) necessary to win those rounds.
Yeah, I’m sure Lieberman, Landrieu, Nelson and Bayh will be intimidated by our show of strength, such that they’ll vote more progressively on those issues if we just kill HCR.
Oh, and I almost forgot, one GOP Senator will be intimidated enough to defect and vote for truly progressive bills in those areas.
Look, I see where you’re coming from. I’m frustrated as all hell. But I just don’t see the win coming out of killing this bill, whether in terms of immediate human costs, or for improving the Dems electoral prospects, or for improving the media narrative or for somehow winning Republican Senatorial support for bona fide progressive legislation going forward.
January 23, 2010 at 6:12 pm
Insurance does not equal healthcare.
curv3ball I love ya, but STOP saying that.
Of the people who file bankruptcies in this country for medical reasons, 75% of them already have insurance.
A lot more people might be insured if the Senate bill passes — mostly because they will be forced to buy insurance policies — but there isn’t any guarantee that those insured will get actual fucking healthcare.
January 24, 2010 at 8:12 am
Of the people who file bankruptcies in this country for medical reasons, 75% of them already have insurance.
Right Will, but the insurance companies refuse to cover the illness/disease/event in question because of a policy called recission, or because of non-coverage because of pre-existing condition.
The Senate bill prevents insurance companies from doing either.
But I’m all for fixing the bill regardless. Though I’m not sure the House bill is that much better on the fronts that you complain about.
January 26, 2010 at 5:59 am
Actually, many of them wind up in bankruptcy because they can’t afford the 20 or 30 percent co-pay of a medical bill in the hundreds of thousands of dollars.
January 26, 2010 at 8:00 am
True.
But would they be in a better position without insurance? I think in those instances, the copay is something like 100%.
January 23, 2010 at 1:23 pm
Whether or not the bill is a piece of shit, and whether or not it even passes, Dems have no choice but to fight hard for its passage. After all the time spent negotiating and working angles to get where they are now, Dems HAVE to fight for it…it’s THEIR bill… they can’t pretend that, all of a sudden, it doesn’t matter, that gee, we only have 59 votes, so never mind. They have to at least ACT like they care, and if the bill goes down, they’ve got to immediately start informing the American people that at least they tried to get health care for them, and it was power hungry obstructionist Pugs who, for purely political reasons, did everything they could to block HCR that Americans have said over and over that they want. And they’ve got to hit that message hard every day, and with one voice.
January 23, 2010 at 2:32 pm
As we can see, none of us have the foggiest clue other than it sucks.
January 23, 2010 at 2:43 pm
No, the status quo sucks. This bill makes the status quo less suckier. Not the most inspiring battle cry, but it will alleviate much suffering. And that really doesn’t suck.
here are some reasons.
January 23, 2010 at 2:55 pm
here, with neat graphics
January 23, 2010 at 2:50 pm
You’ve made my point quite clearly. This bill is a compromise of a compromise of a… I forget. If Obama used his bully pulpit, like he has in the past few days about the banks, then maybe America would ignore the soon-to-be-seen Aetna commercials about how awesome your drugs are and stop funneling money to the Chamber of Commerce.
The point is this rift in the smart people – i.e. the Netroots. As long as Larry Summers, Tim Geithner, and Ben Bernanke are running the show, there is no reason whatsoever to support anything this 3/5 Senate is proposing. And healthcare is too important to trust to the likes of who you pointed out, Curv3. I hate to say it, but Paul Krugman be damned, and gogogo Joe Stiglitz, Jamie Galbraith, etc.
January 23, 2010 at 3:07 pm
there is no reason whatsoever to support anything this 3/5 Senate is proposing. And healthcare is too important to trust to the likes of who you pointed out
We don’t have to “trust” anything. They’re not making promises that we have to trust, or giving us their word that requires us to take it at face value. They have ALREADY passed the Senate bill. Full stop. All we have to do is read the bill. That has been passed already. Not trust Joe Lieberman.
See the links I posted upthread about the benefits of the bill, as written.
And if healthcare is so important, then we should definitely pass this. Here’s why: in US history, each time health care has been defeated, the next time it comes up, it’s weaker.
After FDR, Nixon’s plan was worse. Defeated, largely by progressive demands for better.
After Nixon, Clinton’s plan was worse. Defeated nonetheless.
After Clinton, the Senate bill is worse.
But next time (20 years and hundreds of thousand dead later)…ponies!
And as someone already said: These types of programs always start small and get improved later. See, ie, Medicare.
I hate to say it, but Paul Krugman be damned, and gogogo Joe Stiglitz, Jamie Galbraith
I’m a fan of all three. And they all agree on the major issues like the size of the stimulus, regulation of finance, etc.
So bless them all.
January 23, 2010 at 4:36 pm
“No, the status quo sucks. This bill makes the status quo less suckier.”
By “it”, curv3alicious, I meant the status quo, especially the circumstances bu which bright shining HCR has become a faint gleam of itself.
I haven’t written any Congrgresscritters letters urging them to drain the bathwater along with the Down syndrome dwarf fetus.
What sucks is that even this this shriveled bill most likely won’t pass. Another sucky facet: probably the bulk of those 35 mill it would help haven’t done squat to promote HCR.
Malcolm X despaired of this in the 60s when he told us that the black populace could, if it engaged as an electorate, dominate American politics.
I’d love to save the world but it won’t even return my calls.
January 23, 2010 at 7:57 pm
Trouble is, there’s nothing in the HCR bill worth having. They did away with everything except the mandate that everybody has to buy the insurance industry’s shitty products.
And it really burns me that all you sniveling little pants-pissers are willing to sell us all out to the insurance industry in the vain hope of eking out a few more years of miserable existence. Grow a fucking spine, and learn to deal with the fact that you’re going to die someday just like everybody else.
January 24, 2010 at 4:09 am
OK, that’s total bullshit. I don’t like it either, but it will save lives and save money it will become popular and it will be amended and expanded. This is, unfortunately, a plea bargain. Except I’m not the one doing time, the working poor with no Health Care insurance are, and as they are indisposed I’m advocating for their interests and if I thought for one second that anything was better then nothing then I would agree. The history of all progressive legislation shows that it’s going to constantly be amended no matter what. There are precedents like Medicare. So don’t be stupid about this. Nobody is brave when they lose their house because of medical bills. There is not a shred of Romance there. I’ve been advocating for the working poor my entire life, and I don’t have the right to suggest that especially in this environment where CU v. FEC is the law anyway, to not get any deal done. In twenty years one million people will die if we fuck up again. This is like voting for Nader, Gore loses, W. cums in your asshole and appoints the two votes that result in CU v. FEC. It was two Reagan appointees, two W. appointees, and one GHW Bush appointee who did this. I vote against Republicans because Dole would have been worse then Clinton, GHW Bush was worse then Clinton, W. was worse then Gore or Kerry, McCain would be worse then Obama, especially with a nut a heartbeat away from a 70+ year old. Democracy is a numbers game, if you don’t like it, organize more.
January 24, 2010 at 4:15 am
I’m sick and fucking tired of working people fighting working people, progressives fighting progressives, because that make Dick Cheney jizz in his Dockers. Jesus FUCKING CHRIST!!!!!!!!!!!!
This is like in “The Life of Brian” in the Coliseum scene which relates to the Trotsky/Stalin/Lenin bullshit from the Russian Revolution. People with common cause forming factions fighting each other preserving the status quo.
January 23, 2010 at 9:22 pm
Ooh… *serious* internet incivility. (Andy Griffith voice) Hooo-WEE! That’s what happens when there’re 61 comments and only one music vid.
I blame Kleber, wherever he’s hiding his audiovisual arse.
Realist: I’d sell you to the grand and gorgeous Goldseal dogfood cannery in Birmingham, AL just to eke out a few more days of (not miserable!) jubilant consciousness. Hell, I’d smoke you if you could get me high.
(I wonder if that cannery still exists.)
January 23, 2010 at 9:24 pm
Abba Zaba Doo!
January 24, 2010 at 3:59 am
http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/12/why-progressives-are-batshit-crazy-to.html
January 24, 2010 at 3:59 am
“Why Progressive are batshit crazy to oppose this HCR.
January 24, 2010 at 4:01 am
Dr. Zaius consels us:
Kick Ass
January 24, 2010 at 5:07 am
Nobody is an incrementalist by choice. The benefits of dictatorship is that El Jeffe can make radical changes very fast, that’s one of the unintended consequences of democracy. democracy is the worst system, except for all the other ones. democracy is predicated on the theory of natural rights and you can’t have one without the other. I believe that there are certain inalienable right’s that all humans have by virtue of their existence, and therefor self-evident.
That means that all 300 million of us, or whatever, minus the kids, have a say and I understand that the rights of the minority shouldn’t be abridged but the 40% of the Senate that is Republican are the economic elite and not the minority, because they partner with 20 or more ‘Democrats’ who are those seats in place of other Republicans that would be 25-75% worse on voting for our issues.
This is how it’s set up, until they change the system nobody can get anything done because now the corporations are paying for the votes and the votes are for subsidies for the corporations, but within that mutated system when you can steal a crumb or get a crumb program online, to save the people I think have co-equal natural rights to me, I do it, while I ask the people to flex their power to change their laws in their government.
The government isn’t a “them” it is us, we are just absent in enough numbers. We the people, but since we the people allowed a power vacuum or more likely they sized our mutual assets and territory and started to sell it back to us, as we work for them selling it back to us, we must take it back like Martin King enforced his natural rights and took the execution of the protection of his innate rights back because he persuaded enough people, and the cause was just and common sense. So rally now, because with democracy as history shows us, you either use it or lose. It’s not a theoretical abstraction it’s a civic duty like jury duty.
You have a moral obligation as an American citizen to participate to the fullest extent of your capacity or this system will not work, and they will and did take it away and replaced it with what will be a multiply reduced megaCorp, there will be more war, famine, and scarcity in the future no matter what because they have over consumed and they don’t follow their own self interests as theorized. As abstract as blackhole, but as real as 50% personal bankruptcy rate over health care bills, pig shit lagoons, net neutrality and coal tar pits. Take your pick of your favorite issue, this campaign funding issue where corporations are individuals with rights and no responsibilities nor the ability to prescribe jail time to create accountability, prevents progress on all of them.
Because everyone involved is a cog, barely conscience of their power, with plausible deniability to culpability and enough credits to buy back the things that the corporation took and reassembled so you can be sufficiently distracted to be used like tinder wood for no real purpose other then to perpetuate and expand a system that then becomes unstable and implodes only hurting the by-standers and not the policy makers or the real economic beneficiaries.
Most of us didn’t serve in the military or the peace corps, maybe it’s your turn now to give back, because Grandpa and Grandma sure as fuck did give their 2 bits for the perseveration of democracy during the wars and for civil rights. So get involved in asking that we legislate this corporations are people con game the gangs invented. Don’t get mad, get even.
January 24, 2010 at 10:08 am
“So get involved in asking that we legislate this corporations are people con game the gangs invented.”
I agree. I’m not writing any letters begging anyone to please pass like a kidney stone what’s left of HCR, but I will write letters to foment legislation to rollback the corp as person tripe.
Not that it will do any good, mind you, but it will help me feel better about myself as I await major socioeconomic upheaval.
January 24, 2010 at 7:45 pm
“..legislate [away].”
January 24, 2010 at 5:17 am
I swear to Hell that it’s all the outstanding Craft MicroBrew Beer, exciting cocktails, access to media, and instant gratification, and amazing attitudes about sex, and Intergalactic Weed that wasn’t around in this dimension, all in abundance that keeps us liberals nice and quiet and mooing like cows, some of us cows moo a little louder or halt when they are pushing us in the truck, but… . I think the people who accomplished all of those amazing progressive victories are absent. Masturbation is so socially accepted, why should anyone be pissed off? Laptop, wi-fi, Delicious Beers, video games, and liberated women? Automation? I’m not coal mining. I don’t work in a textile mill. I got mine. Trust me they will fuck you, maybe they haven’t yet, but we all get sick someday and when you do then you see how much Christianity has done for you and the Indians.
January 24, 2010 at 5:24 am
Oh I forgot about the Rx drug system. Where a Rx is the answer for everyone. Everyone over 30 is on a Rx, it seems. don’t get my wrong some people depend on some drugs and that’s excellent but those people don’t get access because other people are over prescribed redundant drugs and/or drugs they really don’t need. There has been a proliferation of medicated people, and alcohol mixed together, people think they are Zeus. When I was a kid there were like ten drugs I knew the names of. Get off my lawn!
January 25, 2010 at 10:21 am
I think you’re onto something. Imagine what the world might be like if Prozac had never been invented.
January 25, 2010 at 10:25 am
I’m not saying it would be better, just different.
January 24, 2010 at 5:18 am
Also, I claim this blog for Xe. This blog has always been owned by Xe. You are all trespassing.
January 24, 2010 at 5:33 am
Liberals are caffeinated enough to type to advocate for the working poor who are actually working the dirty jobs but too drunk or stoned to do anything about it. Quasi-Romanesqe, which is coincidently the name of my new Smooth Jazz Disco record.
January 24, 2010 at 10:05 am
“Smooth Jazz Disco record”
I see the record industry lobbyists got to you.
January 25, 2010 at 8:52 pm
So what if it astroturf:
Meet ellie Light
January 25, 2010 at 11:15 pm
For curv3 and kleber:
If we had HCR this lady could get the mental counseling help she needs
January 25, 2010 at 11:50 pm
Yep, I remember that one, that was a good one. It relieved a lot of pressure so people could continue to be keyboard commandos.
http://ourstodecide.org/
Enjoy my stupid, lame, suckass goup.
January 26, 2010 at 7:37 am
As sucky as these guys? :
January 27, 2010 at 9:52 am
Yo Kleber and curv3! I read that House Progressive were humping for a public option. That inspired me to actually contact my representatives and express my strong support.
As valid as your better-than-nothing logic is, the difficulty with passing a mostly lame bill using mostly lame means is probably too much for persons whose lives are a constant popularity contest. They need excitement to get through this current stagnation.
I’m massively hungover, so morning phone calls were all I could muster for now. I will send emails later today.
Lightning bolt! Lightning bolt! Lightning bolt! (Nothing like a sense of impotence and futility to start the morning right.)
January 27, 2010 at 12:41 pm
good man, fight the power.
January 27, 2010 at 2:55 pm
I go through periods of fairly focused congressional cage-rattling and long periods of silence, partly because I have debilitating illness that drains my will and what will I have is used holding my life and family together. (Wasting time on goofy blogs serves as IV drip for my soul between working on a novel and doing what little I can around the house and all that.)
But also, I don’t want to be a drone background, a constant progressive signal that politicians take for granted. I strive for dynamics, to catch a wave that serves progress and add my lardass to its momentum.
This year, HCR.
Next year, the goddam Justice Department.
Then, alternative energy.
Then, meaningful economic reform and, if he hasn’t punked out, reelect Obama.
By which time my imaginary roots-prog band, The Mellotrones, will have resurrected punk disco into the Next Big Thing.
I think we should march on Washington wielding foam-and-duct tape cardboard swords and official Star Wars light saber cheese-cutters, our unison chant being Lightning Bolt! Lightning Bolt! Lightning Bolt!
Each and every one of us wearing a Ken By Request latex mask, and holding high our tattered copies of Keyboard Kommandos Pocket Edition.
Led by a Hillary love doll with pinwheel nipple swastikas.
January 27, 2010 at 3:58 pm
Join the club man, I’m in the same boat, but If I don’t do it, who will?
January 27, 2010 at 4:08 pm
Well, *someone’s* got to keep that love doll pumped up.
January 28, 2010 at 8:13 am
Well kenmeer, either that or we all dress as ‘furries’.
January 28, 2010 at 5:40 pm
Let us imagine 50 years into the future. It’s Furries Night at the Senior Center…
January 28, 2010 at 6:08 pm
This thread has achieved triple digit post inflation. Time for a government bailout.
January 28, 2010 at 6:22 pm
Oops. Wrong thread. (I’ll blame it on my glasses. Yeah! That’s the ticket!)
January 28, 2010 at 10:03 pm
Oops. Right thread. I forgot that posts don;t count replies. Triple digit indeed.