I believe that if Obama moves to the center, and governs from the center, he will overcome the well-supported historical trend that high unemployment at election times leads voters to punish the incumbent party.
Maybe he should just govern from the right. And make preparations to kill Iranians. I hear that they are brown. Everyone rallies around a war president.
These words are inherently, demonstrably true. Certainly, whatever policy package you prefer–whether it’s elminating taxes on the wealthy while deporting all minorities, or simply rounding up the rich and liquidating both them and their assets to feed to the poor–is a centrist policy that all thinking people can agree with.
NBC News: “For all the talk of the Tea Party’s strength — and there will certainly be a significant number of their candidates in Congress — just 32% of all Tea Party candidates who ran for Congress won and 61.4% lost this election. A few races remain too close to call.”
In the Senate, however, 10 candidates backed by the Tea Party ran and at least five were successful. (The race in Alaska has not yet been called.)
curv3ball, that’s ridiculous. Your policy package (heh) would have led to even bigger gains for the GOP. How can you not see that? My policies, on the other hand, would have resulted in rainbow pony unicorns for all.
The people have decided!
They voted out the bullies who beat them up and took their lunch money, and voted in the geeks.
Then, when the geeks couldn’t salve their wounds and return the stolen money fast enough, the voters put the bullies back in.
Actually I don’t think anyone really tried to return stolen money. Where’s the hearings on the mortgage/foreclosure fraud? Oh yeah, that was ALan Grayson.
Where’s the prosefuckingcutions of fraudulent banksters? Crickets…
I wanted to vote democrat, but I got into the polling booth and just couldn’t pull the lever for a party whose figurehead continues to kill brown people with killer flying robots. I just had to vote how I really felt in this historic, most important election ever.
Presumably there does exist a set of policies that, had the Obama Administration pursued them, would have prevented the Republicans from taking over the House. (To believe otherwise is to accept that it was inevitable that the Republicans would take over the House.) Certainly, the policies the Obama Administration did pursue did not prevent etc., etc. Ergo, if keeping Democratic control of the House was the goal, the Obama Administration’s policies were flawed.
There is also presumably at least one set of policies Obama could pursue that would result in his being re-elected, and sets of policies that would not. (And Boehner has already announced that the Republican agenda for the next two years is to prevent Obama from being re-elected.)
If one accepts that keeping the House would have been better than losing the House and that re-electing Obama would be better than not, one would want the Obama Administration to stop listening to the fuckwads who crafted the policies of the last two years and listen to the rest of us for once.
Uh, we’ve spent our time here for years making fun of conservatives. Vast networks of intelligent (and funny!) dems/libs squandered on mocking retards.
Oh, it’s fun. I do it. But we’re not Jon Stewart. We’re American citizens, and we get what we put out.
Oh, I’m sure most of us have done some kind of our part. But obviously, something has been broken for awhile and what we’ve all really done is pine, like silly hound-dog-eyed conservatives, for a return of the middle of the road leaning left (well, not leaning so far right) old days.
When Obama proved chickenshit, everyone sat down and sighed, and that seemed to have been that.
Obama? It’s the entire fucking party! I’m done with this “oh, they really want to help us crap.” If they wanted to do it they would. They don’t. They are the bullshit centrists they fucking campaign as.
They don’t get left wing enthusiasm because they don’t do anything for the left wing. And spare me your shit health care bill and laughable financial reform. Even if those were decent bills, it’s still next to nothing considering all the other crap.
I agree, Nutella. I cited Obama because he was our unicanarycorn. He was supposed to drag them kicking and screaming into decent levels of progressive accomplishment. He had the mojo if he used it. He could have had both parties begging for mercy because he has the articulatory chops. Mr. Charisma with the finest extemporaneous skills I’ve heard since… since no one.
But he did the opposite.
And no one on the left expects good things to come from the Reps being in greater power. But no one on the left expects good things to come if the Dems held power.
I’m not blaming us for the current state of affairs. The momentum was already in place. I’m just saying we knew this by a year or so after Obama’d taken office. Our rationalizations for his mildness and concessions didn’t hold up. Anf for me, as I’m sure for many of us, the real kicker was how Obama furthered rather than regressed Buscheney inflicted civil liberty abuses, including more torture and now assassination of USA citizens for shits and giggles.
I blame us for pacing ANY hope in this election other than to retain vibrant progressive rock stars like Feingold (I has a sad). Always nice to keep a hero or two around if possible. Beyond that, it was obvious that BOTH parties need their asses kicked and kicked again. I blame us for pretending that this election was about anything but ongoing collapse.
When you’re tacking against the wind, you know you have to expend a lot of wasted lateral motion to move forward, but if it;s what you gotta do it’s what you gotta do. But if you can only gain 10 yards per sweep while the tide is taking you out 100 yards per sweep, you need to stop kidding yourself that you’re making headway and admit that you are, in fact, being swept out to sea.
I stopped paying attention just before the reform bill, so I admit that maybe it was good. However, the people whose opinions I trust have told me otherwise.
But I don’t think that makes Democrats good, and the whole point is that being slightly better than the repubs ain’t a whole heckofa fucking job.
There just isn’t much fucking difference. Corporate power isn’t being checked in any meaningful way. I’m sure you’ve all read GG expound on the continuation and excalation of the surveillance secrecy and gulags, and we’re still bombing brown people’s countries, only now with a frownie face.
you can’t taste the difference. When the dems start aligning their priorities anywhere close to mine, I’ll start voting for them again. Until then, I’m voting green. If they want my vote they can come and take it.
i know ur all going to hate me for pointing it out but i think that jon stewart and his mentality is a big reason why the democrats lost so bad. theres a lot to be angry about in this country and instead of recognizing it as legitimate anger he made fun of it and told ppl to tone it down and had a rally about how everything is really ok just have ur latte and take the kids to soccer and u can ignore all of the insane things happening all around u. after all ur too busy to care passionately about politics.
and the democrats were the same. if u voted for obama u should be angry b/c he has not done a lot of the things he campaigned on. still torturing ppl for example and all that talk about living wages stopped at inaugeration. yeah hes done some stuff to make liberals happy but dont get too happy about that healthcare bill its a total giveaway to insurance and medical companies his biggest donors.
but the democrat candidates werent angry they were just all saying that things are actually pretty good were making progress blah blah blah. do u realize that it is b/c the tea party and republicans were angry it showed they cared but the democrats are all like no things are getting better. bs. things are not okay ppl even if jon stewart tries to convince u that it is.
if u are on the right or the left u should be angry not passive. only one party showed that it was interested in doing something and surprise surprise that party won big. im not happy about this btw.
so stewart and colbert can enjoy their ironic humor and so i hope they enjoy the irony of them helping elect republicans.
Well, they (insurance companies) want to kill the beast they had to grudgingly admit to come to parturition albeit as messed up as a thalidomide baby.
Yes it IS a baby, and after so many miscarriages, it’s nice to have something kicking in the bassinet.
harris, anger ain’t shit by itself. Huff and puff didn’t make this election turn as it did. Poor performance by the leading party and hysterical hypnosis by gazillion dollars of 99% fact-free sick’em ads from the right did.
You gotta think, not rage. Find a solution then apply it. I for one think that the old play book, which pretty much has only one play — get out the vote for your side — works anymore. If we don’t want to become a Chinese colony, we need to start thinking and acting outside the box.
Hysterically, though, you’re not the only person I’ve heard try to pin some blame on Jon Stewart.
It’s the jester’s fault! Chris Hedges has too.
And yes, torture is still allowed. If it’s allowed, it’s happening, particularly after 8 years abroad with troops gone psycho on successive tours.
There’s this little place called gitmo. They been around forever but really gotten popular in the past 10 years. Serve up a mean indefinite detention.
I mean, I didn’t hear about any massive replacement of every single person there, so I’m guessing a few former employees were around for the torture. Seems evidence to me they’d keep doing what they love best.
oh, and Bagram. And just the general continuation and expansion of all other Bush policies that would indicate to me that Obama has decided not to make any substantiative changes.
Seriously, why are you so fucking naive just because he’s a democrat? If a repub refused to prosecute officials for war crimes, wouldn’t you take that as evidence that they’re only doing so so that they might keep the power for themselves?
Even if they’re not, doesn’t failure to prosecute enable torture? Isn’t that just as bad as actual torture?
I mean, fuck, where is your evidence or proof that Obama has done anything to stop torture?
So, your answer is “No, I have no evidence, just some speculation.”
That’s what I thought. The problem is, torture leaves evidence. We learned this under Bush. There was a ton of evidence of torture. Photos. Videotapes. Memos. Officials bragging about it. Corpses. Coroners’ reports.
And now? You’ve got nothing. You’ve got an observation that two prisons in which torture happened are still open, and leaped to the conclusion that torture is still happening, despite having not a shred of evidence of any such thing.
Oh, btw, the answer to your last question, evidence that Obama has ended torture, can easily be found here:
I think harris makes some good points here.
The passion of the rebranding of the arch-right wing of the GOP was what won it for them, that and the media jizzing all over them.
But I think one good lesson is to learn is that the liberal wing of the Democratic Party COULD do the same thing. Have our own “outside the mainstream” Party meetings. WHere we offer real solutions (single payer) and display our own anger: (No more War on the Middle Class! No more silly Wars,period!, No more Corporate Personhood). Call it the Pot Party if you want. (Pissed Off at Tyranny)
Yes, fine, I have no proof. Few things do. There is, however, ample evidence and, as you say in the beginning, it’s a moot point if assigning moral culpability is the game.
So like all arguments, it is damn well possible that I’m wrong. I don’t see any reason to believe he’s not capable and/or willing given the other failings and he certainly has the means, motive, and opportunity.
I’m not upset, just slightly exasperated that you don’t seem to get my point. You keep asking for proof and I keep telling you that there is no “proof” but plenty of evidence. I don’t know what I’m missing but I feel like we reached middle ground, and you keep insisting that we’re totally at odds.
I think we’re much closer than middle ground on almost everything to do with this administration.
I didn’t mean to be niggling, I just didn’t find the evidence you listed as ample or persuasive.
Torture is the one area that I think Obama “may” have improved on Bush.
At least, I haven’t seen anything to indicate otherwise. And I’ve had this discussion with many people, and evidence is always the question mark, so I sincerely was just trying to see if there was something I was missing.
Apologies for returning to that point too often if I did.
I think one of your old posts, best posts, the one about unshitting the bed in Iraq (or was it Afghanistan? Someplace we’d shat, and we’ve shat so many for so long now) is instructive here. Eventually, being the type, Bush & crew shat the domestic bed, too. And Obama, though he largely stopped the domestic bed-shitting and reduced the flow in Iraq to a loose dribble, was unable to un-shit the sheets. So, and here’s the fun part, the electorate brought back the original shitters, as though this would somehow reduce the shitpile and restore the satin sheets of prosperity.
Stupid, the lot of them. And so here we are, preparing to break the slats under the weight. And the GOP is all smiles as they squat to power and, no doubt, re-shit the bed.
“And Obama, though he largely stopped the domestic bed-shitting and reduced the flow in Iraq to a loose dribble, ”
what, we’re like, almost down to only 50,000 people? And he’s just moving them to Afghaniland? And bombing Pakistan? And talking about bombing Yemen? And continuing the yearly increases in military spending?
In order for things to get better in this system “the people” have to be prepared for some really radical change – and the only way that’s going to happen is if one of the major political parties crashes and burns thoroughly. I wish it were the republicrooks, but honestly, in a “real” election between a credible progressive/green/socialist party and the current democrats, I’d have a harder time voting for the current flavor of democrat than I would have had voting for Reagan. (aka “The Second-Worst President of all Time”*) So I voted for the dems, not wanting to be part of making things that much worse – but if having them complete their utter and total failure is the price we must pay to get a real progressive alternative, then “bring it on” sez I.
(*this is open to debate – my 16 YO son thinks the #1 WPOAT award should go to Andrew Jackson, who in addition to being a white supremacist asshole who said things about the Supreme Court that were worthy of Dick Cheney *also* dissolved the federal bank, setting the stage for the lovely economic situation that we all enjoy today. This would (in his scheme) make RWR #3. I’m still partial to GWB as biggest fuck-up evar over the long run)
Since I have been exceptionally harsh on our disappointing unicorn pony, I will share something very good about what some folks call Obamacare.
My daughter has severe chronic pain via CRPS (Chronic Regional Pain Syndrome) and scarred nerve tissue in her neck at the spine from botched surgery regarding her CRPS.
Even with the pain, she moved out and into her own place. She’s stubborn and independent. All them good conservative self-reliance values. But the effects of chronic pain mount over time, and also the nerve damage took awhile to fully deteriorate. She lost her job due to poor attendance (and falling down at work when sudden stabbing pains brought her to her knees). Moved home.
But she’d been away from home long enough we’d had to drop her from our insurance, and then her insurance through her employer of course canceled.
She went on Medicaid. Only one pain management doc in town accepts the shit pay that Medicaid provides (Medicaid needs health care reform too). Luckily, she accepted my daughter. But it sucks knowing your doc is probably losing money for seeing you, and knowing that pain management practice has one of the highest burnout rates in the biz, so you worry that your doc will quit next year.
BUT! through Obamacare (I know, it’s really Republicare, but brand names are brand names) parent can keep kids on their insurance through age 26, insurances can;t deny for preexisting conditions, and we’ll be able to place her on our insurance when we reenroll this January.
Then our daughter will have options and will be able to get the psych counseling a person really needs after 4 years of their body becoming a live-in torture chamber that requires her to stay throughly whacked out on levels of pain meds that would literally knock us unconscious since we’re not acclimatized to it like she is.
Frankly, if Obama would just clean up his Dept of Justice I could tolerate the slow crawl of progress. But remember Johnson? Civil Rights and Great Society didn’t stop Dem discouragement with him. When you’re napalming innocent villagers in rice paddy villages, social progress at home just doesn’t taste right.
We want to talk about gradual reform and sound fiscal policy, and that stuff’s important, but our moral resolve can;t help but be pathetic when we’re having to ignore the howls of innocents being hammered by our military to win their hearts and minds.
I know we’d rather work for gradual change domestically but we’ll do this much better if we demand immediate restoration of what we used to call civil *liberties* and also demand we stop catering to misguided military foreign policy.
And there really ain’t no one gonna do it for us. Colbert and Stewart are comedians, however brilliant and humane, Rachel Maddow’s just one person, and Bill Moyer’s almost as old as Jimmy Carter.
That’s a great story as to why where the rubber hits the road HCR is making a difference in the lives of real people. I also have a chronic pain conditions due to several spinal cord injuries, failed surgeries, and thoracic disk ruptures that are too dangerous to operate on, and I agree the Medicaid system pays around $9 a visit for doctors. It’s abhorrent for dealing with chronic conditions. It’s only because I got my injuries on the job when I was working my way through College in a Warehouse that I have any access to a pain doctor. Even with meds my body is the same torture chamber you describe, but at least they’ve prevented me from homelessness and/or suicide which is what happens to most pain patients. Due to pre-existing conditions the only health insurance I could get was Medicaid and I only have that in case of another health issue, there are no pain doctors in my area that would take me if I wasn’t on workers comp. It’s a sad state of affairs, and as I’ve been living with torture like pain for 13+ years, please tell your daughter to keep fighting and never surrender to this fucked up society who can’t comprehend suffering, as I couldn’t comprehend suffering until it was me who was in it. If your daughter ever needs someone to talk to who understands the emotional, physical, and psychological toll please feel free to have her contact me. We hell on earth people have to stick together.
“That’s a great story as to why where the rubber hits the road HCR is making a difference in the lives of real people. I also have a chronic pain conditions due to several spinal cord injuries, failed surgeries, and thoracic disk ruptures that are too dangerous to operate on, and I agree the Medicaid system pays around $9 a visit for doctors. It’s abhorrent for dealing with chronic conditions. It’s only because I got my injuries on the job when I was working my way through College in a Warehouse that I have any access to a pain doctor. Even with meds my body is the same torture chamber you describe, but at least they’ve prevented me from homelessness and/or suicide which is what happens to most pain patients. Due to pre-existing conditions the only health insurance I could get was Medicaid and I only have that in case of another health issue, there are no pain doctors in my area that would take me if I wasn’t on workers comp. It’s a sad state of affairs, and as I’ve been living with torture like pain for 13+ years, please tell your daughter to keep fighting and never surrender to this fucked up society who can’t comprehend suffering, as I couldn’t comprehend suffering until it was me who was in it. If your daughter ever needs someone to talk to who understands the emotional, physical, and psychological toll please feel free to have her contact me. We hell on earth people have to stick together.”
Yeah, acupuncture doesn’t work for me. It’s like if you had five rotten teeth with deep cavities, pressing on your nerves, and they can’t pull the teeth because that would make you a paraplegic. These ruptured disks press on my spinal cord’s thecal sacs which press on the spinal cord. It hell, so they have to give me the tough medicine. So I never get to drink a beer, or smoke a joint, because it’s Fed Rx my doctor tests my urine randomly. It’s a lot of fucking fun. The meds don’t give you a buzz once your system is acclimated, but if you miss a dose you feel like that kid in traisnspotting when he’s locked himself in his bedroom. It’s a lot of fucking fun. It’s like being a chemical prisoner.
Yup, The pills I take are on a twelve hour time release, and you’re OK for about 14 hour, but after that your get this restless leg syndrome, which is like electric shocks through your body, and essentially flue like symptoms if you had the dengue fever. I don’t get a choice of doctor because they have a system called medical provider networks, and this MPN I’m only has one doctor. He’s a good doctor, but if he decides to retire or move, or whatever, you get too look forward to a two week compounding of your pain that you are being treated for to begin with and then the withdrawal symptoms.
The combination of meds does work for me, I can get what I need to do done, and I’m not a zombie or anything. But you still feel the pain, it’s just more manageable for your mind to deal with. It’s not only the pain, it’s the fear of more pain, and the fear involved with forced dependence. It’s a lot of fucking fun…did I mention that. I’m lucky to have a family that understands, because most people like me end up dead at their own hand, or homeless, dependent on lots of booze and/or street drugs.
It ruins your career, it ruins your relationships because 99% of new dates don’t want to deal with all of this once they hear the details of degenerative disk disease, the inability to earn a living and keep health insurance within the confines of medicaid, and that you’re on meds that the tee vee tells them make you a monster. The stigma.
So I often wonder if I died and am in hell. I tell people, honor their health, and count their blessings, because they don’t know what never ending horror is like in this society that decides that people like me a losers in the market place, that need to set apart and ignored. Broken machines are an annoyance in the big factory and people don’t want to deal with reminders of their own mortality through you.
Fuck man, I hear you. I’m prolly in 1/10th the shape you’re in, but I know exactly waht you’re saying. Right now I’m living off a little inheritance, but every fucking day I wonder what’s gonna happen when that runs out in a couple years.
This is the predicament of unseen hundreds of thousands, if not a million or two. The cracks are becoming easier to fall through, and most people don’t think it can happen to them, but it can happen to anyone. When I was felled I was a happy, healthy 21-year-old.
25 for me. I can still be happy, on the good days…when I can forget about the fear of never again being employable. But when one day out of five leaves me not wanting to leave the bed… who knows. So in a crack I sit…
and you’re def right about the unseen. Most people I meet do not know many others with chronic pain. I explain to them that there are plenty of people who have it, it’s just that I’m lucky that I can still leave the house and since most end up by themselves in front of the TV, or worse.